Upcoming disk brake and Master cylinder article

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Upcoming disk brake and Master cylinder article

Post by Smuz » Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:09 pm

I'm in the process of putting disk brakes on Sancho. Taking lots of pics for a future "How-To". When I started on this, I decided that EVERY LJ could benefit from disk brakes. So I decided to make a "universal bracket template" that could be used for all LJ's (from LJ10 to LJ80-II) for both front and rear.

After I do Sancho (LJ80-II), I'm gonna do Sleepy (LJ20). This should cover the entire line of LJ's. This article will prolly be in three parts.

1. SJ413 master cylinder install and piping. This will cover the actual physical mounting of the master cylinder, including redrilling the mounting holes in the Samurai master cylinder, modifying the pushrod (where necessary), and adding another brake line (on the single systems) and splitting front and rear systems for the duplex master cylinder.

2. Front disk brake installation. Bracket fabrication, installation and set-up.

3. Rear disk brake installation. Bracket fabrication, installation and set up. (oooh, I'll prolly do a rear wheel bearing replacement how-to at the same time)

I intend to write this article so that anyone with normal tools, a band saw (such as the Harbor Freight $80 one) and a cheap drill press can easily do this upgrade with no welding or machine shop work. All you should need is some scrap steel plate, and Samurai front brake calipers and rotors.

This article will prolly take almost to the first of the year to complete. Lemme know what you think of the concept and if I've missed anything.
The above is my opinion. It is subject (like all my opinions) to debate, disagreement, rude gestures, and loud raspberries.
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Post by Smuz » Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:16 pm

BTW: here's a pic of my "Amazing Universal Template". Made from 3/16" steel. No patent and untested as yet, but cool nonetheless.

hehehehe.
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Post by Smuz » Wed Sep 20, 2006 4:09 pm

Here's a teaser.....
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Post by Smuz » Sun Nov 26, 2006 10:37 am

Here's another teaser.
Got all the parts fabbed and aquired except for 2 more calipers and the 4 rotors. Hoping to start the work week after this.
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Post by Smuz » Thu Nov 30, 2006 4:38 pm

OK. This article is gonna be in three sections:
Section 1: Master cylinder upgrade with SJ413 master cylinder. Fully reversable.
Section 2: Front disk brake fab and install. Also fully reversable.
Section 3: Rear disk brake fab and install. Also fully reversable.

Master cylinder work is done. Starting to write the how-to article tonight. I hope to have it to Jimny sometime tomorrow.

Now leave me alone and let me write. :Þ
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Post by Smuz » Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:34 am

OK. The article is now online and looks pretty good.

Please, everybody look and comment on typos and mistakes. I've read it over about 16 times and Jimny's gonna proof read it, but I know some are gonna slip thru.

www.lj10.com/howto/discbrakes/
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Post by Jimny » Fri Dec 01, 2006 12:56 pm

Another good job Smuz!!!!!!!!!!! :beer:
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Post by Harald » Fri Dec 01, 2006 1:09 pm

Smuz wrote:So now we reach the end of this little upgrade. Not too bad, was it. And what an improvement it is. We’ll have to get together again sometime. And next time YOU bring the beer
I promise, when we'll meet I'lll bring the beer. :wink:

Very good description. I like the style of your writing.
But there is one thing I would do different to you.
I would awake the mice under the seat before working at the car.
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Post by tweeder » Fri Dec 01, 2006 1:52 pm

Smuz wrote:One word of warning for those doing this mod but not up grading your wheel brakes: You had better keep a close eye on your brake adjustments or you are in for a very rude surprise. If your brake shoes get too far out of adjustment, that SJ master cylinder has enough volume to push the wheel cylinder right out of its socket. That’s ugly and messy and you could roll back down hill and hit a tree. Just ask Sancho (hehehehe).
so is that the final verdict of what happened to him :?:
A legend in my own mind.
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Post by Smuz » Fri Dec 01, 2006 1:59 pm

so is that the final verdict of what happened to him
Yep. Mud had completely ate the brake linings off of the left front wheel. When Jay stomped on the brakes, the piston popped partially out of the wheel cylinder. That was the main cause of the loud, shrill, girlish scream you heard just before the big crash.
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Post by Smuz » Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:11 pm

Harald wrote: I promise, when we'll meet I'lll bring the beer. :wink:

Very good description. I like the style of your writing.
But there is one thing I would do different to you.
I would awake the mice under the seat before working at the car.
Yeah, but they're really big mice and they got teeth and no sense of humor.

Thanks for the compliments. If you're bringing the beer, see if you can get Parkbrau. I LIKE that stuff. At least I seem to remember liking it.
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Post by Ruby » Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:44 pm

Great article Smuz. The more I think about it, I'm sort of leaning towards building my LJ 81 to be more original, but with a few upgraded parts, such as your brake swap. I do have another frame that still has the original driveline mounts on it. mmmmmm I better think this over. That means I'll have to buy another LJ, nothing wrong with that!
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Post by Frankenstein » Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:22 pm

Looking good so far :cool:
I hate rust...

The older I get the better I was...

http://www.suzukilj80.nl" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Post by Smuz » Tue Dec 05, 2006 7:54 pm

Interesting thing I just found out. (interesting= gawdammit, howdid this happen?)

The stock LJ20V 15" wheels will NOT fit over a disk brake upgrade. LJxx open 16" wheels will fit fine. 15" SJ wheels will fit fine. Aftermarket 15" wheels will fit fine.

It's just those 15" original LJ20V wheels that won't fit! I dunno about LJ80 15" wheels.

Damn!
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Post by stevec » Wed Dec 06, 2006 10:31 am

LJ80 15" wheels are either the same as LJ20V wheels (earlier models), or are the same wagon wheels used on early Samurai's (like on my LJ81). The early style are 15x4.5", wagon wheels are 15x5.5". Is the problem with the narrow width?

I guess if I ever convert my LJ20V to disk brakes, I'll have to put the Tacoma wheels on it.
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Post by Smuz » Wed Dec 06, 2006 10:51 am

Is the problem with the narrow width?
The problem is that the inside of the wheel hits the caliper. The safety bead surface on the wheel just ain't long enuf before the wheel reduces diameter.

Right now I got Wilson's old 16" military tires and wheels on Sleepy. I got a set of stock Sammi wheels I'm gonna use when I put swampers on him, but Mouser's using them right now.
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Post by Smuz » Sun Dec 10, 2006 7:35 am

Just a little info for anyone that isn't sure if a Sammi master cylinder is much of an upgrade.

LJ MC is 3/4" bore.
SJ MC is 15/16" bore.
Pedal stroke is about 1 1/4"

Figgering area times stroke gives the SJ MC has 167% of the volume of an LJ MC.

That's over 1 1/2 times the volume.

Feel free to check my math.
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Post by Jimny » Sun Dec 10, 2006 8:02 am

Feel free to check my math.
I'm sure Steve will, just in his head!


COOL! I knew it had to be a great deal more but DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMN! So much better then the stock LJ setup. I can't wait to do the brakes on Ranger.

Still waiting on the second (and third) installment of the 'howto'. *hint, hint*
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Post by Smuz » Sun Dec 10, 2006 8:30 am

Still waiting on the second (and third) installment of the 'howto'. *hint, hint*
I'll see if I can get section 2 done this week and just bring it with me on a jump drive or a CD.
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Post by Jimny » Sun Dec 10, 2006 9:03 am

:cool: I like how good you did on the first section, can't wait to see the second!
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Post by stevec » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:14 am

Jimny wrote:
Feel free to check my math.
I'm sure Steve will, just in his head!
Doing it in my head I get only 156%, not 167%. Pi is a constant, as is the stroke I assume, so the ratio is simply based on the radius squared.

When we order pizza, my wife always says we should just get a smaller one... There's usually only about a $1-2 difference between medium (13") and Large (16"). Most people don't realize that the large is actually more than 50% larger than the medium. Plus, I like leftovers!
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Post by Frankenstein » Mon Dec 11, 2006 11:53 am

When we order pizza, my wife always says we should just get a smaller one... There's usually only about a $1-2 difference between medium (13") and Large (16"). Most people don't realize that the large is actually more than 50% larger than the medium. Plus, I like leftovers!
Now i get it, you need a bigger seat because you're good in math :D
Glad I'm not a wizard at it...
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Post by stevec » Mon Dec 11, 2006 12:13 pm

Actually, I'm not good at math, I just like pizza, and I'm good at faking it!
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Post by Frankenstein » Mon Dec 11, 2006 12:31 pm

:cool:
I hate rust...

The older I get the better I was...

http://www.suzukilj80.nl" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Post by Jimny » Mon Dec 11, 2006 12:34 pm

Do let him lie to ya, he's GREAT at math..... and pizza!
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